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  #1  
Old 05-09-2012, 01:08 PM
Dave Dave is offline
Rear Engine Rider
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: RI
Posts: 111
Default SEF Fuel

Does anyone know what happens when you put this fuel in a tank that had ethanol fuel in it. or vis a versa. When I switch to ethanol in my boat i had major issues

thanks
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  #2  
Old 05-09-2012, 05:00 PM
oldtimer oldtimer is offline
Rear Engine Rider
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pensacola, Florida
Posts: 174
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Nothing happens, except, the fuel system gets cleaned out and the engine runs much better.

No more:

Hard starting
Fouled plugs
Broken recoils
Plugged spark arresters
Replacing carburetors
Replacing fuel lines
Unhappy customers

More:

Happy customers
Repeat business

A 2 cycle engine has 2 speeds, idle & full throttle. The harder you use 2 cycle engines the cleaner they run. The 94 octane SEF, TruFuel and MotoMix are excellent products.

Oldtimer
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  #3  
Old 10-26-2012, 12:29 PM
SawDoc SawDoc is offline
Senior Zero Turn Mower
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eastern Ky.
Posts: 303
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I got word the other day that an independent lab had tested most of the pre-packaged fuels out there and Stihl Moto-Mix was the only one that consistently tested at or above the listed octane rating. All of the others tested in the low to mid-80's. Stihl is supposedly putting up some big bucks to have this verified so they can use it in their advertising.
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  #4  
Old 10-30-2012, 02:46 PM
carlsmower carlsmower is offline
Senior Zero Turn Mower
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ferndale Wa
Posts: 206
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Sawdoc. Where did you hear this tidbit of info? That is very interesting. We sell both Tru Fuel & Stihl Motomix and I quite honestly thought they were the same less the oil component.
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  #5  
Old 04-19-2014, 05:15 PM
stihlydan's Avatar
stihlydan stihlydan is offline
String Trimmer
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hampton, VA
Posts: 1
Default Sorry to tell you this but....

I can not confirm or deny the octane claim. However I can tell you several things you did NOT know.

First everything regarding Moto-mix is different. The entire formula comes from Stihl and is only packaged by Omni. NOTHING is similar to Tru-Fuel or any other fuel what so ever with the exception of the can used.

Moto-Mix has little to no aromatics. Stihl's MSDS lists Benzene at <.5% ALL the others have more than 20%. Some as high as 30%. There was a time (I have those copies) when the other companies' MSDS had the contents of aromatics. In responding to this post, I pulled up the latest MSDS sheets and they now have none shown. I know their formulas have not changed. So I can conclude they are getting wise to aromatics and now choose to not show that content.

If you google fuel aromatics you find it is composed of Benzene or may be referred to as aromatic hydrocarbons. These products cause swelling of rubber products.

With regard to what this canned fuel may do if used after other fuels, let me tell you what we have learned in our shop and by personal experience at home as well.

In 2007 I started having a problem with my own gas powered golf cart. Once a month I would get what I call a "brown jell-o" in the carburetor. I would clean it out and a month later it was back. This went on for a year until I decided to use a preservative. You know like Sta-bil or Star-Tron. I used the stuff from Briggs and Stratton. Since using a stabilizer, I have not had the "brown jell-o" problem again.

So I assumed there was something in the fuel that would precipitate out. As long as a preservative was used, it stayed in suspension. Incidentally, I still get complaints about the RED colored Sta-Bil so we only recommend the blue colored one.

Now here's the good part. I have a customer that has a water cooled Kawasaki 2 cylinder John Deere front mount mower. For 17 years never had a single problem with it. 3 summers ago he saw Star-Tron in Lowe's and put it in the mower. Within 2 hours the mower stopped and would not restart.

We took it in, cleaned the carburetor, replaced the fuel filter and lines and it has been good ever since. So what? We figured that because he never used a preservative, the "brown jello" I spoke of had simply coated the inside walls of the fuel tank. All was status quo until he put the Star-Tron in it and that washed off the brown jello and sent it head long into the carburetor.

So we recommend to anyone that has equipment that sits for long periods of time like power washers, tillers, generators, leaf vacuums and such. That they always use a "blue" preservative in all the fuel. We also see the brown jello in mixed fuel units so we recommend 100% of fuel used in them always contains "blue" preservative. I keep saying blue cause it seems to us the red Sta-Bil does not work with ethanol. Even though there is one that says it does and another that does not say ethanol on it, why chance the confusion. I know the blue one works. We have been using it for 5 years in our shop now without incident.

So to the gentleman that asked about using the canned fuel after regular gas, I say be careful that it does NOT wash contaminate out of the tank. The contamination may be purely age related. It could be area of the country as in different fuels. It could be heat related. We simply don't know.

I want to tell you some more about preservative and fuel. For example, fuel begins to break down 30 days after it is refined. Now no one can say that on a certain day fuel is useless. But, remember this. Once fuel has gotten to a certain point in the break down process, no amount of preservative is going to slow the process down.

So that means, you must put preservative in the fuel the moment you buy the fuel. Now you will get longer life to the fuel as long as the container it is in is air tight. You want a laugh, read the packages of Briggs & Stratton fuel preservative. It states it keeps fuel fresh for up to 3 years. Yeah right!

When the fuel is subjected to air, it's life is significantly reduced. Yeah it is longer with the preservative then it would be without it. But once you put it in a piece of equipment, the life of the fuel with preservative goes way down.

How far down, we tell people to be safe, don't leave it in equipment more than 30 days. Remember gas tanks on devices are not air tight. If they were, the engine could not draw the fuel out of the tank. Now if the fresh, preserved fuel is in an air tight container, you can keep it for 6 months. To be safe, no longer.

NOTE: Stale fuel used in a 2 cycle engine, or in a hybrid like Stihl 4-mix, will wipe out the piston and cylinder. Even though the engine starts and appears to run like normal.

Here's another tidbit of info. Plastic fuel cans deteriorate and put little (almost microscopic) bits into the fuel. This causes clogs in the carburetor. So it is recommended to replace the fuel can every 4 years or so.

I was having to replace the carburetor on my Stihl trimmer every year. I'm lazy and I get them cheap so I don't feel like cleaning them or rebuilding them. Since changing to Moto-Mix 3 years ago, I haven't done anything to the trimmer.

Here's another piece of news that I have not confirmed. I heard that in the ground tanks at gas stations, the concentration of ethanol usually exceeds what is pumped into it. For example I heard (again not confirmed) in a 10% ethanol tank, the concentration of ethanol can rise to as much as 40%.

One last morsel and I will leave you. What happens with 15% ethanol and higher?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceW9Nc1hVHU

The heavier ethanol drops to the bottom of the tank. Now the bottom portion is straight ethanol. So since most fuel systems draw from the bottom of the tank, guess what gets burned? Straight ethanol until it's gone.

Now guess what happened to the gasoline above the ethanol? When the ethanol separated out, it took the remaining gasoline down 3 octane levels. So if you started with 87 octane, it now has 84 octane. Try using that in power equipment in the summer. Pistons will melt.

Put that in your tank and smoke it folks. Incidentally you can write to me at certified.lawn@outlook.com
__________________
Snapper Pro, Exmark, Husqvarna and Stihl dealer. In the bus since late 70's. BS in electrical engineering. Shop located in Southeastern VA.

Last edited by stihlydan : 01-28-2016 at 10:44 AM.
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  #6  
Old 04-20-2014, 08:00 PM
SawDoc SawDoc is offline
Senior Zero Turn Mower
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eastern Ky.
Posts: 303
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Stihlydan, I agree with your comments concerning fuels and preservation. We tell our customers to use Moto-Mix if they can afford it, otherwise, fill the tank with Moto-Mix and run the unit 10-15 minutes before storage. Like you, I use it in my personal equipment and it WORKS. People often ask me whether to drain the fuels system before storage or leave it topped off. My opinion (and it's only an opinion) is that if you are ABSOLUTELY SURE that there are no gum and varnish deposits lining your fuel tank, lines, etc., then drain it. In essence, you are storing it in the same condition as it was before purchase. However, if you're not sure, treat your FRESH fuel with a good stabilizer/ethanol treatment, and leave it full. That way deposits do not harden during storage. But be sure to change your fuel again before putting the equipment back into service. Keeping your fuel fresh and treated is the cheapest PM money you can spend.
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  #7  
Old 06-06-2014, 10:21 AM
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SuperiorPower SuperiorPower is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 616
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So, am I understanding correctly that Stihl has duked Tru-Fuel into canning a superior product for Stihl only and Tru-Fuel isn't smart enough to use the same product as their own? Or are they allowed to use the Tru-Fuel can but Tru-Fuel has no idea of the product being put in? Guess I don't understand.
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  #8  
Old 06-06-2014, 01:07 PM
oldtimer oldtimer is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pensacola, Florida
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Quote:
I got word the other day that an independent lab had tested most of the pre-packaged fuels out there and Stihl Moto-Mix was the only one that consistently tested at or above the listed octane rating. All of the others tested in the low to mid-80's. Stihl is supposedly putting up some big bucks to have this verified so they can use it in their advertising.
The Stihl MotoMix is based on an engineered fuel from Germany..It is shipped thru the port of Houston, Texas, trucked to Shreveport and canned by TruSouth Oil Company using Stihl's HP Ultra Oil.

Every shipping container of fuel is tested and Stihl's claims are based on fact, not fiction.


Oldtimer
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